June 18, 2024
From Legal Battles to Chocolate Bars: Finding Purpose with Shawn Askinosie
In this episode, I sit down with Shawn Askinosie, founder of Askinosie Chocolate, whose journey from criminal defense lawyer to chocolate maker is as powerful as it is unexpected. After nearly two decades of handling serious felony and murder cases, Shawn found himself at a crossroads when the emotional toll of the work began affecting his health and perspective on life. What followed wasn’t an overnight transformation but a slow search for purpose that eventually led him to the world of craft chocolate—and to building a company rooted in connection, transparency, and community.
Our conversation goes far beyond chocolate. Shawn shares how traveling to the Amazon to meet cocoa farmers changed the way he saw the world, why his company practices profit sharing with the farmers who grow their beans, and how initiatives like Chocolate University are helping young people experience global connection and service. Along the way we talk about grief, purpose, human connection in an increasingly digital world, and the moments in life that remind us we’re exactly where we’re meant to be.
Episode Highlights
[02:13] – Shawn reflects on his career as a criminal defense lawyer and the emotional turning point that led him to reconsider his path.
[04:56] – How a series of hobbies—including baking and making chocolate desserts—eventually led him toward chocolate making.
[06:15] – Shawn’s first trip to the Amazon to meet cocoa farmers and what it felt like stepping into a rainforest for the first time.
[09:50] – The early challenges of building a bean-to-bar chocolate company and educating people about craft chocolate.
[13:15] – The philosophy behind Askinosie Chocolate: “It’s not about the chocolate… it’s about the chocolate.”
[17:06] – Shawn shares a powerful moment when he realized he was on the right path.
[24:39] – How profit sharing with cocoa farmers helps support families and communities around the world.
[30:54] – The mission behind Chocolate University and how travel experiences are shaping young people’s perspectives.
[43:26] – A deeply moving story from Tanzania about hospitality, connection, and the power of human relationships.
Links & Resources
Instagram: @AmeliaOldOfficial
Website: https://AmeliaOld.com
If this episode resonated with you, please consider following, rating, and reviewing Voices of Inspiration wherever you listen. Your support helps these stories reach more people—and reminds us all how powerful our shared stories can be.
Chapters
00:03 - Journey of Inspiration and Transformation
09:42 - Navigating Challenges in Building Relationships
21:48 - Developing Sustainable Business Partnerships
34:48 - Embracing Human Connection Through Transformation
44:12 - Experiencing Hospitality and Finding Purpose
53:26 - Words of Wisdom and Inspiration
Transcript
WEBVTT
00:00:03.849 --> 00:00:05.112
Everyone has a story to tell.
00:00:05.112 --> 00:00:08.509
We connect and relate to one another when we share our stories.
00:00:08.509 --> 00:00:12.089
My name is Amelia Old and I am your host of Voices of Inspiration.
00:00:12.089 --> 00:00:17.199
Join me as I share stories of friends, family and strangers from my everyday life and travels.
00:00:17.199 --> 00:00:25.355
You will laugh, possibly cry or walk away, feeling connected more than ever to those around you and ready to be the change our world needs.
00:00:25.355 --> 00:00:27.385
Everyone has a story to tell.
00:00:27.385 --> 00:00:28.068
What's yours?
00:00:38.341 --> 00:00:42.527
First of all, I want to say thank you for taking time to be with me today.
00:00:42.527 --> 00:00:55.805
I am so excited about this talk we have a lot to talk about, actually, and you are so inspirational and I can't wait to learn more about your path and your journey to where you are now.
00:00:57.509 --> 00:00:58.612
Thank you, thanks for having me.
00:00:59.820 --> 00:01:08.534
So this morning, when I was getting ready, I watched your TED Talk Find your Calling when it Hurts, from 2019.
00:01:08.534 --> 00:01:15.950
And I want to encourage everyone to take time to watch it and I'll link to it in the notes of this episode.
00:01:15.950 --> 00:01:19.489
But I immediately related to this message.
00:01:19.489 --> 00:01:29.593
My brother passed away when he was 18 years old, and that is where my own journey of service to others began.
00:01:29.593 --> 00:01:49.385
Three weeks later, hurricane Katrina happened and all I could think about was just pouring myself into something else versus continuing the grieving that I was in in that moment, and a quote at the time stuck with me, and it still does, and it's sometimes in tragedy.
00:01:49.385 --> 00:01:50.989
We find our life's purpose.
00:01:50.989 --> 00:02:00.573
The eye sheds a tear to find its focus, and I felt like that was so in line with your message.
00:02:00.573 --> 00:02:02.418
You've had quite the journey.
00:02:02.418 --> 00:02:05.629
You started out as a criminal defense lawyer message.
00:02:05.629 --> 00:02:07.114
You've had quite the journey.
00:02:07.114 --> 00:02:11.760
You started out as a criminal defense lawyer and I just want to.
00:02:11.760 --> 00:02:13.364
Can you talk about the moment that you decided to transition?
00:02:13.484 --> 00:02:15.127
from this career to pursuing chocolate.
00:02:15.127 --> 00:02:15.927
Yes, thank you.
00:02:15.927 --> 00:02:36.129
And let me just also, before I begin, acknowledge your own grief and heartbreak and sorrow, and I think that it absolutely can be a sort of pathway for many of us, a doorway to a greater joy.
00:02:36.129 --> 00:02:51.574
Kind of paradoxically, but for me, I did criminal defense law for almost 20 years and I specialized in really serious felony cases and murder cases.
00:02:51.574 --> 00:02:55.050
Murder trials is really where I built my reputation.
00:02:55.050 --> 00:03:03.627
But there was a particular murder case toward the end of that 20 years.
00:03:03.627 --> 00:03:10.996
It was very high profile and really emotionally just exhausting.
00:03:12.540 --> 00:03:29.743
And at the conclusion of that case, or near the conclusion of the case, right before closing arguments, there was this moment with my client outside the courtroom in an ante room where lawyers can talk to their clients.
00:03:29.804 --> 00:03:35.020
It's a real small room so they can talk privately about whatever.
00:03:35.020 --> 00:04:06.282
And it was in that room and in that moment that I kind of saw that the roles were reversing between me as the advocate and a protector for my client, and my client then became sort of a protector, in a way, of me, and that's really not the way it's supposed to work.
00:04:06.282 --> 00:04:11.926
I wasn't really ready for that, but it really did sort of shift things for me.
00:04:11.926 --> 00:04:38.273
And then you know, you know it started to unfold after that, and then it wasn't too long after that that I kind of noticed I could be in court on a really simple thing, I mean just a court appearance, nothing really at stake, and I would have chest pains, and I learned later that it was probably a panic attack of sorts.
00:04:38.273 --> 00:04:40.947
And that's when it shifted for me.
00:04:40.947 --> 00:04:45.211
That's when I realized I needed to kind of find something else.
00:04:45.211 --> 00:04:47.007
I just didn't know what else to do.
00:04:47.007 --> 00:04:50.891
I didn't have any other ideas, but that's when it started.
00:04:51.560 --> 00:04:52.685
What led to chocolate?
00:04:52.685 --> 00:04:54.305
How did that come about?
00:04:55.800 --> 00:04:57.204
So what really?
00:04:57.204 --> 00:04:58.329
That's a great question.
00:04:58.329 --> 00:05:05.915
And I did not have some like lifelong passion for chocolate.
00:05:05.915 --> 00:05:08.267
I didn't really at the time.
00:05:08.267 --> 00:05:10.728
I just kind of started developing hobbies.
00:05:10.728 --> 00:05:21.088
I bought a big green egg to learn how to cook outdoors and then I started baking, then I started making chocolate desserts.
00:05:21.088 --> 00:05:29.661
So that was kind of the pathway, chocolate desserts.
00:05:29.661 --> 00:05:30.322
So that was kind of the pathway.
00:05:30.322 --> 00:05:48.571
And at the same time that that was happening I was volunteering at a local hospital on Fridays, just visiting with patients in palliative care that had asked for a volunteer to come visit, and so all that was kind of happening at the same time and it all happened over about a five-year visit and so so all that was kind of happening at the same time and it all happened over about a five year process.
00:05:48.571 --> 00:06:02.072
I just didn't know it was going to be five years at the time, but just really desperately searching and then one thing led to another and I just kind of landed on chocolate.
00:06:02.273 --> 00:06:08.612
Really, you decided to go straight to the source to get your beans.
00:06:08.612 --> 00:06:10.625
What was that experience?
00:06:10.625 --> 00:06:12.471
Like the very first time you did that.
00:06:14.761 --> 00:06:34.293
It was a really moving experience because I'd never I'd been outside the country before and I went to college in Japan, so I'd certainly traveled, but I'd never seen what's called a primary forest or rainforest like this.
00:06:34.673 --> 00:07:01.235
And so within a few months of deciding that I was going to make chocolate, I went to the Amazon and that's where I learned first how farmers can influence flavor by how they what's called post-harvest the beans, so how they ferment the beans and how they dry the beans can really influence flavor.
00:07:01.857 --> 00:07:37.651
But being in primary forest was kind of an overwhelming experience for me because and I'm sure you can relate to this because you've traveled extensively and I read about your going to Mount Everest base camp, so you know it's really you and I'm sure many of your listeners can relate as well there comes a point in some travels where you say to yourself this is bigger than me and if I'm not really careful I could be lost forever if I take one wrong step.
00:07:37.651 --> 00:07:59.841
You know, and that's the way I felt in the dense dense rainforest, the way I felt in the in the dense dense rainforest, um, we had a guide, um, who was um Ochoar tribe from the Amazon, and without him, I mean, we would have been lost and that's really that's a.
00:07:59.841 --> 00:08:00.483
That's a.
00:08:00.483 --> 00:08:09.954
It's an overwhelming feeling, but it's also really kind of liberating, in a way, to have that feeling and to recognize it at the time.
00:08:10.437 --> 00:08:11.220
Yeah, absolutely.
00:08:11.220 --> 00:08:24.952
I can remember when we did go to Everest and being in Nepal and in the journey it almost didn't seem real that you know because it is so different than where we live.
00:08:24.952 --> 00:08:27.843
Didn't seem real that you know because it is so different than where we live.
00:08:27.843 --> 00:08:40.482
And, yes, you know, we can travel to some of the the well-known places like London or Paris and and these big touristy places, and that's very different than putting yourself in a situation like you're talking about or Nepal.
00:08:40.482 --> 00:08:42.505
When you're doing a trek like that.
00:08:42.666 --> 00:08:57.423
It is a whole nother world yeah, and I also had kind of a, a moment of awareness of creation that I had never really experienced before in other travels.
00:08:57.423 --> 00:09:05.754
I I mean, I've been in thailand and, like I said, j um, but I it was a, it was.
00:09:05.754 --> 00:09:09.642
It was that as well, sort of like wow this is creation.
00:09:09.923 --> 00:09:41.932
This is pretty raw and, um, like I said too, it felt bigger than me and especially as a hard charging motivated you know trial lawyer that wants to control everything, I realized I was out of the way and it was hard at first, but that difficulty and that challenge didn't last long because I tried to just kind of and in some ways you don't have a choice but I just tried to let go.
00:09:42.542 --> 00:09:47.984
So what have been some of your biggest challenges that you faced since starting Askinosie Chocolate?
00:09:50.028 --> 00:09:56.486
The challenges that we have faced have really interestingly changed over the years.
00:09:56.486 --> 00:10:09.990
So in the beginning the challenge was convincing people what bean-to-bar chocolate was and why people should pay, you know, a lot of money for a chocolate bar.
00:10:09.990 --> 00:10:10.964
That's three ounces.
00:10:10.964 --> 00:10:17.692
That, you know, appears to cost three times more than a Nestle or Hershey bar or four times more.
00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:22.431
And so we were one of the first people to do this in the United States.
00:10:22.431 --> 00:10:36.816
There were like three of us that were starting, and that was the first challenge was just educating and informing people about what this is and why it's a value and why it's important, and sharing the story.
00:10:36.816 --> 00:10:43.812
That was really the first challenge and over time the challenges have just kind of ebbed and flowed.
00:10:43.812 --> 00:10:49.143
The challenges have just kind of ebbed and flowed.
00:10:49.143 --> 00:11:02.148
Most recently, the challenge is that right now, the price of cocoa beans has skyrocketed and in the last 12 months the price has increased about 300% and that's our main ingredient.
00:11:02.148 --> 00:11:15.850
Now, fortunately, I go buy the beans myself and travel to meet with farmers every year, and in a few weeks I'll be in Tanzania, and so I know these farmers quite well.
00:11:15.850 --> 00:11:27.250
In almost all cases, I'm approaching nearly 20 years with some of these farmers, and so we will work through it.
00:11:27.250 --> 00:11:44.130
But you know the price of that commodity just has a whole slew of challenges and you know considering price increasing for our own product and how to manage cash flow and all of those things.
00:11:44.130 --> 00:12:11.585
But I do think that over time, that all of our organizations and, candidly, all of our relationships and just our lives and our bodies experience entropy and we see the kind of erosion of the edges over time and I mean I see it in my body, I mean I see it in my face.
00:12:11.585 --> 00:12:14.288
I can look at my face and think, wow, there's some entropy right there.
00:12:14.288 --> 00:12:42.067
We have to decide how we will allocate resources to preserve the erosion, where we can and where we choose.
00:12:42.067 --> 00:12:51.624
If you're not careful, you will experience erosion and it will not be reparable.
00:12:51.624 --> 00:12:58.783
But because we're paying attention to it and trying to watch it and be aware of it, then we can address it.
00:12:58.783 --> 00:13:15.344
And so that's what we're thinking about lately is how we adapt, and so that's what we're thinking about lately is how we adapt, how we maintain our quality, which is really important to us, and the ethos for us for all these years.
00:13:16.705 --> 00:13:24.490
I can't remember if I used this in the TEDx or not, but we say it's not about the chocolate, it's about the chocolate.
00:13:24.490 --> 00:13:37.197
And so when I say it's not about the chocolate, I mean this summer in Tanzania we're going to graduate our 10,000th young person from our afterschool program in 10 years.
00:13:37.197 --> 00:13:48.609
We have something called Empowered Girls and Enlightened Boys, and it's in and around the village where we buy beans there.
00:13:48.609 --> 00:13:54.884
We support that program and started that program and teach young people life skills, and we provide feminine hygiene products for the girls so they can go to school.
00:13:54.884 --> 00:13:59.052
And that's 10,000 kids in 10 years.
00:13:59.052 --> 00:14:01.844
That's a lot for a company our size.
00:14:01.844 --> 00:14:03.285
We're 20 people full-time.
00:14:03.285 --> 00:14:07.732
Our foundation, the Chocolate University Foundation, has one employee.
00:14:07.732 --> 00:14:08.754
That's it.
00:14:08.754 --> 00:14:13.431
And then we have two people in Tanzania that work for us.
00:14:14.720 --> 00:14:17.549
But that's not about chocolate.
00:14:17.549 --> 00:14:31.288
It's about connection, it's about community, it's about our supply chain and engaging with them as humans in a spirit of mutuality and kinship.
00:14:31.288 --> 00:14:36.159
On the other hand, what we do is everything about chocolate.
00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:50.956
We focus entirely on the quality of the product and making sure that the beans that we get from the farms are perfect and that the roast that we give the beans to influence flavor is perfect.
00:14:50.956 --> 00:14:53.802
Trying to win awards, like I said earlier.
00:14:53.802 --> 00:14:55.408
You know, when I started there were three of us.
00:14:55.408 --> 00:15:10.394
When you enter a competition with three people, you're going to win something, but now there's like 300, you know, maybe 350 chocolate makers in the United States, but we're still winning awards and that's something I'm really proud of that we can balance those things.
00:15:10.494 --> 00:15:25.979
That it's not about the chocolate, it's about the chocolate, and what that really boils down to is the product that we make is inseparable from who we are, and that's true for you, it's true for all of us.
00:15:25.979 --> 00:16:10.820
Whether we provide a service or whatever, we can't separate who we are as people from what product we deliver or service we provide, and so if we're careful about that, then we can do some things to hold off entropy in our organizations, but also remembering that everything ends, and so that's a real challenge, I think, especially in North American culture is we have trouble with endings because we don't like them, and I understand that because they can be very painful.
00:16:11.850 --> 00:16:35.961
but so even companies end you know, our bodies end and that's hard it's really hard, but it's something we about the chocolate from.
00:16:36.121 --> 00:16:48.417
From an outsider like myself, it's also about all the lives that you're changing beyond your, your own inner circle, and I think that that is really incredible.
00:16:48.417 --> 00:16:54.695
Can you describe the moment that, or a moment that you knew I have made the right decision?
00:16:54.695 --> 00:16:57.947
Switching careers Like this is the moment that, or a moment that you knew I have made the right decision?
00:16:57.947 --> 00:17:01.735
Switching careers Like this is the moment that it's clicked.
00:17:01.735 --> 00:17:05.163
I know this is what I'm supposed to be doing.
00:17:06.270 --> 00:17:07.852
Thank you for asking that question.
00:17:07.852 --> 00:17:22.551
And there are so many moments and what makes that possible is not that there are more moments, but that I'm more aware of them.
00:17:22.551 --> 00:17:25.476
The moments are always there.
00:17:25.476 --> 00:17:28.540
They never are not there.
00:17:28.540 --> 00:17:36.921
They were there when I was in my thirties, you know trying cases, I just wasn't as aware.
00:17:38.683 --> 00:17:57.262
Um, I was thinking about this yesterday and I remember when my daughter was in um community theater and she was probably 10 years old or 11 and she was Annie and in the production of Annie and singing, and I would go to all of her rehearsals and she probably didn't like that.
00:17:57.262 --> 00:17:58.992
You know that I was there for everything.
00:17:58.992 --> 00:18:18.617
But I specifically remember moments while I was there and listening to her sing, you know, at a rehearsal or whatever, and I remember thinking to myself and this is a very sort of and this is a very sort of beginning point of awareness.
00:18:18.617 --> 00:18:25.683
I think, and I thought to myself it's not going to get any better than this If I die today.
00:18:25.683 --> 00:18:28.787
It's just fine, it's just not going to get any better.
00:18:28.787 --> 00:18:52.763
And I remember, I thought that at the time and I think it's important for us to cultivate that kind of awareness, and I didn't even know what it was back then and they seemed that I recognized them much less frequently than I do now.
00:18:52.910 --> 00:18:55.596
I'm older, a lot older much less frequently than I do now.
00:18:55.596 --> 00:18:56.117
I'm older, a lot older.
00:18:56.117 --> 00:19:10.714
But, to answer your question, there are many of these that I now see that I didn't see before, and one in particular is in Tanzania.
00:19:10.714 --> 00:19:46.636
Every time we are getting ready to return back to Springfield, missouri, where our factory is and where I'm from, we have a little celebration with the farmers the night before and we have a goat and other stuff on the beach where we are, and this farmer his name is Livingston, but he took me aside and he wanted to give me actually, I keep it on my desk right here he wanted to give me this bracelet and this was given to him by his father, which was given to him by his father.
00:19:46.636 --> 00:19:55.424
This was probably his most treasured possession and he wanted me to have it as a symbol of our friendship.
00:19:55.424 --> 00:20:03.078
And I remember thinking then well, okay, I'm doing the right thing, I'm in the right place at the right time, I'm where I need to be.
00:20:04.309 --> 00:20:36.386
And the following year I had my grandfather's pocket watch restored and I gave it to him, and as a reciprocal symbol of how I felt about him, and so these moments I've come to know are kind of like glimpses of the divine for me, and I know, I know now that they don't last.
00:20:36.386 --> 00:20:43.176
Um, they're just an opportunity for me to remember, so to speak.
00:20:43.176 --> 00:20:47.223
That's a very long answer to your question.
00:20:47.769 --> 00:20:57.410
No, I, I appreciate that and you know, like you mentioned, you had this thought of if I die, that's okay.
00:20:57.410 --> 00:21:05.103
And I have in recent, you know the last year or two, have started feeling that same thing.
00:21:05.103 --> 00:21:06.085
You know what?
00:21:06.085 --> 00:21:15.971
I've lived a thousand lives, it feels, you know, career wise and personally, and done a lot of different things, and so it's okay.
00:21:15.971 --> 00:21:34.864
And I think that's such a um, a comforting feeling because, while, yes, there's so much more that we want to do, um, being aware of you know the like, the word you used, aware of that is pretty powerful in my opinion.
00:21:34.864 --> 00:21:42.212
That is pretty powerful in my opinion.
00:21:42.212 --> 00:21:45.123
Um, how do you establish, or how did you start to establish, relationships with these farmers that you work with?
00:21:47.349 --> 00:21:47.903
The the.
00:21:47.903 --> 00:21:52.731
The way I started it was first I had to find them, and that wasn't easy.
00:21:52.731 --> 00:21:58.765
And even back then, first I had to find them, and that wasn't easy, and even back then we had Google and everything.
00:21:58.765 --> 00:22:12.278
It's just that you, you couldn't Google, you could not use search technology to find them then, and you really can't do that now.
00:22:12.278 --> 00:22:15.955
There, there, there's some ways you could do it.
00:22:16.017 --> 00:22:40.398
Now that would be a little bit easier, but really I had to find them and as a lawyer, I spent my life trying to find people, often people who didn't want me to find them, you know, and so I'm used to almost in the way of a journalist, kind of trying to find people and talk to them, and so that was very common for me.
00:22:40.940 --> 00:22:41.580
And that's what I did.
00:22:41.580 --> 00:22:51.972
To find farmers, I just found people who knew people and who knew other people, and I tried to just not give up when it seemed like I was hitting a wall.
00:22:51.972 --> 00:23:18.000
And once I found them, then we had to make sure that the farmers would be able to meet our specification for cocoa beans, that they're not regulated by the government, so that I could, you know, directly contract with them and pay them directly, help them, open bank accounts, profit share with them, and so that's once.
00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:19.777
We were able to establish all of that.
00:23:19.777 --> 00:23:33.661
Then I just started going to visit them every year and looking at our cocoa beans and getting to know them, and then now they're kids and now they're grandkids, and so it's just like any other relationship.
00:23:33.661 --> 00:23:45.951
It takes time and effort, and I know that these are business relationships, but I also know that they're not just business relationships and that they're friendships.
00:23:45.951 --> 00:23:53.650
And, um, this past February I took my 50th origin trip since I started the company.
00:23:53.670 --> 00:23:59.253
I took my 50th origin trip since I started the company, and so when I go to Tanzania in a couple of weeks, it'll be 51.
00:23:59.253 --> 00:24:03.256
And so that's how you do it.
00:24:03.256 --> 00:24:30.673
That's how you maintain this spirit of of mutuality um and kinship and not, you know, like I'm some kind of solution provider but really a business partner.
00:24:30.692 --> 00:24:38.713
What can you talk a little bit more about the profit sharing with the farmers and and how you've seen that impact their communities and their families and how you've seen that impact their communities and their families.
00:24:38.733 --> 00:24:48.026
The profit sharing is part of an open book management style that we use and I used that as a lawyer and it just basically means that we share numbers.
00:24:52.950 --> 00:24:55.214
We share the financial numbers and then teach what it means and then share in the outcome.
00:24:55.234 --> 00:25:12.900
And so from the very beginning, all those years ago, I knew that I wanted to include farmers in this and kind of let the open book management system apply to them as well, and not just employees in the company.
00:25:12.900 --> 00:25:18.296
And so what that looks like is us preparing consolidated financials and then putting them in their language.
00:25:18.296 --> 00:25:34.855
So in a few weeks our financials will be in Swahili and um then we will show the farmers how we calculate the profit share and um bring them money and hand them money, and we've done that every year.
00:25:34.855 --> 00:25:40.619
And we we publish what we pay the farmers and how much we profit share with them on our website.
00:25:40.619 --> 00:25:54.757
It's not a fancy infographic, it's just a spreadsheet, but we put it on there and it's audited by a local university accounting auditing class, but it's pretty simple.
00:25:54.757 --> 00:26:07.284
That's how we do it, and we pay the farmers a lot more money than they would otherwise have received all these years, and we also pay them in advance in most of the cases, like really far in advance.
00:26:08.109 --> 00:26:25.542
It's like an interest-free loan, you know, for them to operate their harvesting business, operate their harvesting business and that's not easy for us because we don't have a lot of debt, we don't have a big, huge line of credit, and so we're operating out of cash flow.
00:26:26.364 --> 00:26:30.787
And that's a challenge for us sometimes, but it's how we've done it all these years.
00:26:44.297 --> 00:26:50.561
Wow, how have you seen it impact their communities?
00:26:50.561 --> 00:27:04.324
So we facilitated what we call a vision of greatness, and I write about that in my book, and I've helped people and companies and nonprofits develop their own vision of greatness.
00:27:04.324 --> 00:27:13.921
I learned that from my mentor, ari Weinzweig, who is the co-founder of Zingerman's Deli in Michigan and has written about this extensively in many books.
00:27:13.921 --> 00:27:26.079
So when we facilitated this vision of greatness for the farmers, one of the nine points that they wanted to work on was early childhood education in their village.
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:36.577
They wanted a preschool, and so we provided the funding for the preschool, but they built it and they run it and they managed this school, which opened in January of 2020.
00:27:36.577 --> 00:28:15.123
Another example is and this may sound overly simple, but it's very impactful for them One of their vision points was to have homes in and around the village that had a metal roof instead of straw or thatched, and they reported to me last year that all of the farmers in the cooperative so 40 families now all have metal roofs because of the business that we've done with them.
00:28:15.851 --> 00:28:16.714
That's amazing.
00:28:17.317 --> 00:28:18.915
Yeah, and these are just some examples.
00:28:18.915 --> 00:28:24.721
The farmer I work with in Ecuador has been able to send all of his kids to college and one of his kids to medical school.
00:28:25.722 --> 00:28:26.003
Wow.
00:28:28.876 --> 00:28:30.059
So those are some examples.
00:28:31.910 --> 00:28:37.874
I mean, that's a huge impact Some people are not aware of.
00:28:38.253 --> 00:28:49.161
I've spent time in Zambia and in some of the villages there and you know the lack of access that they.
00:28:50.061 --> 00:28:52.624
They just don't have access to some things like like.
00:28:52.624 --> 00:29:39.023
Here's an example Some of the nurses that I met with in this one village, first of all, the patients would have to travel miles and miles because they didn't live near the village and they would travel by bike or by foot and if they were pregnant, they would go to this, this room in this building, and they would just stay there, like in the last couple of weeks, their due date, and they would just stay there until they had the baby, not knowing when they were going to have the baby, and they had no light and the only if they gave birth at night, the nurses would use the light from their cell phone to help these women give birth.
00:29:39.023 --> 00:29:49.763
And so the impact that you and your company have made on these communities is pretty incredible.
00:29:49.763 --> 00:30:05.604
I mean, with the 40 families with Metal Roots, that's a big deal, and I know that some people aren't aware or don't think about that, that something that might seem small to us is life-changing for them.
00:30:06.670 --> 00:30:08.291
Yes, you're absolutely right.
00:30:08.291 --> 00:30:10.534
And what an experience that you had in Zambia.
00:30:10.534 --> 00:30:14.157
I mean, that's something you won't ever forget.
00:30:14.157 --> 00:30:22.526
No, and so I wish more people could have those kind of experiences.
00:30:31.672 --> 00:30:35.230
I could talk for hours about that experience and the families that I met with and the challenges that they faced.
00:30:35.230 --> 00:30:42.166
It was definitely a life-changing experience, to say the least.
00:30:42.166 --> 00:30:48.412
You mentioned earlier Chocolate University.
00:30:48.412 --> 00:30:53.951
Can you talk a little bit more about the impact of that and exactly what it is and how that's impacted the students in the communities that are involved?
00:30:53.990 --> 00:30:56.314
Well, that's quite a segue in the communities that are involved.
00:30:56.314 --> 00:30:57.696
Well, that's quite a segue.
00:30:57.696 --> 00:31:28.701
I don't know if you planned it like that, but so what we do, chocolate University started when we started the company so this is not new and that the idea was to engage the kids around the neighborhood of our factory in Springfield, missouri, and we located the factory in a very old building it was built in 1894 and in a part of our community that was undergoing revitalization and where many social services were.
00:31:28.701 --> 00:31:41.542
On our street, our largest homeless shelter was there and there were 85 kids a night in that shelter, and so we wanted to kind of look at the schools that they were going to and develop.
00:31:41.542 --> 00:31:45.942
So we started an elementary school program, a middle school program, high school program.
00:31:46.691 --> 00:31:59.470
Now we have a middle school summer school program, and now it's in the beginning and for many years it was just a project in our company, there was no separate entity.
00:32:00.070 --> 00:32:16.021
Now there's the Chocolate University Foundation and it's run by donations from our company and from donors around the United States and it's a 501c3 nonprofit with a board of directors.
00:32:16.130 --> 00:32:39.031
My daughter and I are on it as non-voting board members and it operates all of these things that we've been talking about and the reason I mentioned that it was a nice segue is because our high school program for juniors and seniors in southwest Missouri is to teach them the ones that are selected.
00:32:39.031 --> 00:32:51.253
It's a really competitive program and we pay all of the money except a $500 registration fee for the kids that are in it, which it's between $5,000 and $6,000 per student to do this.
00:32:51.253 --> 00:33:05.321
But they spend time in the spring semester learning about our business and everything, and then in the summer they spend a week on the Drury University campus near our factory getting to know each other and learning more about Tanzania language, culture, history.
00:33:05.321 --> 00:33:16.387
They go home and pack, we meet them at the airport and take them to Tanzania to meet cocoa farmers, just like you did in Zambia and the experience that you had.
00:33:16.387 --> 00:33:19.598
I don't know how long ago was your trip to Zambia, I'm just curious.
00:33:21.070 --> 00:33:25.520
It's been quite a few years, maybe seven or eight years.
00:33:26.363 --> 00:33:28.215
Okay, well, this is what I mean.
00:33:28.215 --> 00:33:37.874
So when you spoke a moment ago about your trip to Zambia, I could tell that, even though it was seven or eight years ago, it still impacts you.
00:33:37.874 --> 00:33:41.542
It impacts your thinking and how you feel about things.
00:33:41.542 --> 00:33:48.596
Well, this is what we're trying to do with our Chocolate University students, and we've been doing this now for 14 years.
00:33:48.596 --> 00:33:56.826
We've taken kids every other year to Tanzania, and I'm still in touch with students from the first trip in 2010.
00:33:56.826 --> 00:33:59.093
They were part of our 2009 group.
00:33:59.795 --> 00:34:48.849
One of them is now a tax lawyer in Las Vegas and he's on our board of directors, and another one is an executive at TikTok in Austin, and I see him almost every time I'm there, and I'm there a lot because I have grandchildren there and they still talk about how impactful the trip was, you know, 14 years ago, and so it's really quite amazing and I had no idea at the time that, you know, a two week experience that is transformational really can influence how you think about life and how you move forward in life, and that's what Chocolate University is all about.
00:34:48.849 --> 00:35:00.422
We want to do two things One, we want to inspire young people that business can be a force for good in the world and secondly, really importantly, that there's a world beyond their own.
00:35:00.422 --> 00:35:14.235
And this isn't like a nothing wrong with a mission trip, but this is not like a mission trip where you go build a building for a week and take pictures for Instagram so people can think you're a good person.
00:35:14.235 --> 00:35:15.371
That's not what this?
00:35:15.532 --> 00:35:15.652
is.
00:35:15.652 --> 00:35:17.597
This is an opportunity.
00:35:17.597 --> 00:35:29.141
And I tell the students this I'm like, hey, you're going to see what we do there and and you're going to, you'll have a chance to roll up your sleeves and help, but you're not really helping.
00:35:29.141 --> 00:35:45.663
I mean, it's what you're going to do If you let it, if you let this trip um wash over you, and if you will receive the hospitality that's going to overwhelm you, and if you can receive that and let your heart change.
00:35:45.663 --> 00:35:46.733
That's the.
00:35:46.733 --> 00:35:48.038
That's where the work happens.
00:35:48.621 --> 00:35:51.250
Not in building a building or drilling for a water well.
00:35:51.250 --> 00:35:53.094
We'll do all that, but you're going to.
00:35:53.094 --> 00:36:00.992
If you let, if you let your heart in on this trip, then you're going to be changed, maybe forever.
00:36:00.992 --> 00:36:03.097
That's what Chocolate University is about.
00:36:04.179 --> 00:36:13.472
I love that and it's those interactions with these other communities and these other people around the world that it's like you said.
00:36:13.472 --> 00:36:39.974
Yes, it's great to build a house and do some of these other things those are necessary, but to change yourself or to get, to get um um deep within yourself, connecting with the people, you know, that is where it's at and that's where I always find the most joy when I travel is I want to talk to the locals, I want to hang out with the locals.
00:36:39.974 --> 00:36:42.356
What do they do, like what's their favorite thing to do?
00:36:42.356 --> 00:36:51.802
And it's cliche, off the beaten path, but that's truly what I enjoy, because it's the connections with other people that are going to change you.
00:36:53.864 --> 00:37:06.829
Yes, going to change you?
00:37:06.849 --> 00:37:15.996
Yes, and it so happens that right now, with, let's just say, the tsunami of AI that is present and upon us as we speak, one of the greatest challenges will be.
00:37:15.996 --> 00:37:34.027
One of the greatest challenges will be in-person connections with people, and that could be at the coffee shop tomorrow morning, or it could be halfway around the world next month, when you take a trip and we are losing that.
00:37:34.027 --> 00:37:36.248
You want to talk about entropy.
00:37:36.248 --> 00:37:45.635
This is a place of entropy and that is human relationships and human contact, and I use AI every day and have since.
00:37:45.635 --> 00:38:16.525
Basically, it came out in all ways that you can possibly imagine, but I also see the kind of risks that are going to come with it and with a lot of technology, and so these opportunities for young people to experience human connection is becoming even more and more important, is becoming even more and more important.
00:38:16.525 --> 00:38:34.324
You know, we read all of the time about the crisis of loneliness in our country, and it's true and it's real, and I think things like TikTok and other platforms don't help for the most part.
00:38:35.271 --> 00:38:54.137
And I was talking with a teacher, a high school teacher, two days ago who told me he teaches English and he said that most of his students report that they're on TikTok eight or nine hours a day and that's um a problem.
00:38:54.137 --> 00:39:11.309
And so if I can play a very, very, very small role in helping a young person experience transformation through human connection, then that's what we'll do.
00:39:13.577 --> 00:39:17.126
Um, I also don't think that the pandemic really helped.
00:00:03.849 --> 00:00:05.112
00:00:05.112 --> 00:00:08.509
00:00:08.509 --> 00:00:12.089
00:00:12.089 --> 00:00:17.199
00:00:17.199 --> 00:00:25.355
00:00:25.355 --> 00:00:27.385
00:00:27.385 --> 00:00:28.068
00:00:38.341 --> 00:00:42.527
00:00:42.527 --> 00:00:55.805
00:00:57.509 --> 00:00:58.612
00:00:59.820 --> 00:01:08.534
00:01:08.534 --> 00:01:15.950
00:01:15.950 --> 00:01:19.489
00:01:19.489 --> 00:01:29.593
00:01:29.593 --> 00:01:49.385
00:01:49.385 --> 00:01:50.989
00:01:50.989 --> 00:02:00.573
00:02:00.573 --> 00:02:02.418
00:02:02.418 --> 00:02:05.629
00:02:05.629 --> 00:02:07.114
00:02:07.114 --> 00:02:11.760
00:02:11.760 --> 00:02:13.364
00:02:13.484 --> 00:02:15.127
00:02:15.127 --> 00:02:15.927
00:02:15.927 --> 00:02:36.129
00:02:36.129 --> 00:02:51.574
00:02:51.574 --> 00:02:55.050
00:02:55.050 --> 00:03:03.627
00:03:03.627 --> 00:03:10.996
00:03:12.540 --> 00:03:29.743
00:03:29.804 --> 00:03:35.020
00:03:35.020 --> 00:04:06.282
00:04:06.282 --> 00:04:11.926
00:04:11.926 --> 00:04:38.273
00:04:38.273 --> 00:04:40.947
00:04:40.947 --> 00:04:45.211
00:04:45.211 --> 00:04:47.007
00:04:47.007 --> 00:04:50.891
00:04:51.560 --> 00:04:52.685
00:04:52.685 --> 00:04:54.305
00:04:55.800 --> 00:04:57.204
00:04:57.204 --> 00:04:58.329
00:04:58.329 --> 00:05:05.915
00:05:05.915 --> 00:05:08.267
00:05:08.267 --> 00:05:10.728
00:05:10.728 --> 00:05:21.088
00:05:21.088 --> 00:05:29.661
00:05:29.661 --> 00:05:30.322
00:05:30.322 --> 00:05:48.571
00:05:48.571 --> 00:06:02.072
00:06:02.273 --> 00:06:08.612
00:06:08.612 --> 00:06:10.625
00:06:10.625 --> 00:06:12.471
00:06:14.761 --> 00:06:34.293
00:06:34.673 --> 00:07:01.235
00:07:01.857 --> 00:07:37.651
00:07:37.651 --> 00:07:59.841
00:07:59.841 --> 00:08:00.483
00:08:00.483 --> 00:08:09.954
00:08:10.437 --> 00:08:11.220
00:08:11.220 --> 00:08:24.952
00:08:24.952 --> 00:08:27.843
00:08:27.843 --> 00:08:40.482
00:08:40.482 --> 00:08:42.505
00:08:42.666 --> 00:08:57.423
00:08:57.423 --> 00:09:05.754
00:09:05.754 --> 00:09:09.642
00:09:09.923 --> 00:09:41.932
00:09:42.542 --> 00:09:47.984
00:09:50.028 --> 00:09:56.486
00:09:56.486 --> 00:10:09.990
00:10:09.990 --> 00:10:10.964
00:10:10.964 --> 00:10:17.692
00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:22.431
00:10:22.431 --> 00:10:36.816
00:10:36.816 --> 00:10:43.812
00:10:43.812 --> 00:10:49.143
00:10:49.143 --> 00:11:02.148
00:11:02.148 --> 00:11:15.850
00:11:15.850 --> 00:11:27.250
00:11:27.250 --> 00:11:44.130
00:11:44.130 --> 00:12:11.585
00:12:11.585 --> 00:12:14.288
00:12:14.288 --> 00:12:42.067
00:12:42.067 --> 00:12:51.624
00:12:51.624 --> 00:12:58.783
00:12:58.783 --> 00:13:15.344
00:13:16.705 --> 00:13:24.490
00:13:24.490 --> 00:13:37.197
00:13:37.197 --> 00:13:48.609
00:13:48.609 --> 00:13:54.884
00:13:54.884 --> 00:13:59.052
00:13:59.052 --> 00:14:01.844
00:14:01.844 --> 00:14:03.285
00:14:03.285 --> 00:14:07.732
00:14:07.732 --> 00:14:08.754
00:14:08.754 --> 00:14:13.431
00:14:14.720 --> 00:14:17.549
00:14:17.549 --> 00:14:31.288
00:14:31.288 --> 00:14:36.159
00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:50.956
00:14:50.956 --> 00:14:53.802
00:14:53.802 --> 00:14:55.408
00:14:55.408 --> 00:15:10.394
00:15:10.494 --> 00:15:25.979
00:15:25.979 --> 00:16:10.820
00:16:11.850 --> 00:16:35.961
00:16:36.121 --> 00:16:48.417
00:16:48.417 --> 00:16:54.695
00:16:54.695 --> 00:16:57.947
00:16:57.947 --> 00:17:01.735
00:17:01.735 --> 00:17:05.163
00:17:06.270 --> 00:17:07.852
00:17:07.852 --> 00:17:22.551
00:17:22.551 --> 00:17:25.476
00:17:25.476 --> 00:17:28.540
00:17:28.540 --> 00:17:36.921
00:17:38.683 --> 00:17:57.262
00:17:57.262 --> 00:17:58.992
00:17:58.992 --> 00:18:18.617
00:18:18.617 --> 00:18:25.683
00:18:25.683 --> 00:18:28.787
00:18:28.787 --> 00:18:52.763
00:18:52.910 --> 00:18:55.596
00:18:55.596 --> 00:18:56.117
00:18:56.117 --> 00:19:10.714
00:19:10.714 --> 00:19:46.636
00:19:46.636 --> 00:19:55.424
00:19:55.424 --> 00:20:03.078
00:20:04.309 --> 00:20:36.386
00:20:36.386 --> 00:20:43.176
00:20:43.176 --> 00:20:47.223
00:20:47.769 --> 00:20:57.410
00:20:57.410 --> 00:21:05.103
00:21:05.103 --> 00:21:06.085
00:21:06.085 --> 00:21:15.971
00:21:15.971 --> 00:21:34.864
00:21:34.864 --> 00:21:42.212
00:21:42.212 --> 00:21:45.123
00:21:47.349 --> 00:21:47.903
00:21:47.903 --> 00:21:52.731
00:21:52.731 --> 00:21:58.765
00:21:58.765 --> 00:22:12.278
00:22:12.278 --> 00:22:15.955
00:22:16.017 --> 00:22:40.398
00:22:40.940 --> 00:22:41.580
00:22:41.580 --> 00:22:51.972
00:22:51.972 --> 00:23:18.000
00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:19.777
00:23:19.777 --> 00:23:33.661
00:23:33.661 --> 00:23:45.951
00:23:45.951 --> 00:23:53.650
00:23:53.670 --> 00:23:59.253
00:23:59.253 --> 00:24:03.256
00:24:03.256 --> 00:24:30.673
00:24:30.692 --> 00:24:38.713
00:24:38.733 --> 00:24:48.026
00:24:52.950 --> 00:24:55.214
00:24:55.234 --> 00:25:12.900
00:25:12.900 --> 00:25:18.296
00:25:18.296 --> 00:25:34.855
00:25:34.855 --> 00:25:40.619
00:25:40.619 --> 00:25:54.757
00:25:54.757 --> 00:26:07.284
00:26:08.109 --> 00:26:25.542
00:26:26.364 --> 00:26:30.787
00:26:44.297 --> 00:26:50.561
00:26:50.561 --> 00:27:04.324
00:27:04.324 --> 00:27:13.921
00:27:13.921 --> 00:27:26.079
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:36.577
00:27:36.577 --> 00:28:15.123
00:28:15.851 --> 00:28:16.714
00:28:17.317 --> 00:28:18.915
00:28:18.915 --> 00:28:24.721
00:28:25.722 --> 00:28:26.003
00:28:28.876 --> 00:28:30.059
00:28:31.910 --> 00:28:37.874
00:28:38.253 --> 00:28:49.161
00:28:50.061 --> 00:28:52.624
00:28:52.624 --> 00:29:39.023
00:29:39.023 --> 00:29:49.763
00:29:49.763 --> 00:30:05.604
00:30:06.670 --> 00:30:08.291
00:30:08.291 --> 00:30:10.534
00:30:10.534 --> 00:30:14.157
00:30:14.157 --> 00:30:22.526
00:30:31.672 --> 00:30:35.230
00:30:35.230 --> 00:30:42.166
00:30:42.166 --> 00:30:48.412
00:30:48.412 --> 00:30:53.951
00:30:53.990 --> 00:30:56.314
00:30:56.314 --> 00:30:57.696
00:30:57.696 --> 00:31:28.701
00:31:28.701 --> 00:31:41.542
00:31:41.542 --> 00:31:45.942
00:31:46.691 --> 00:31:59.470
00:32:00.070 --> 00:32:16.021
00:32:16.130 --> 00:32:39.031
00:32:39.031 --> 00:32:51.253
00:32:51.253 --> 00:33:05.321
00:33:05.321 --> 00:33:16.387
00:33:16.387 --> 00:33:19.598
00:33:21.070 --> 00:33:25.520
00:33:26.363 --> 00:33:28.215
00:33:28.215 --> 00:33:37.874
00:33:37.874 --> 00:33:41.542
00:33:41.542 --> 00:33:48.596
00:33:48.596 --> 00:33:56.826
00:33:56.826 --> 00:33:59.093
00:33:59.795 --> 00:34:48.849
00:34:48.849 --> 00:35:00.422
00:35:00.422 --> 00:35:14.235
00:35:14.235 --> 00:35:15.371
00:35:15.532 --> 00:35:15.652
00:35:15.652 --> 00:35:17.597
00:35:17.597 --> 00:35:29.141
00:35:29.141 --> 00:35:45.663
00:35:45.663 --> 00:35:46.733
00:35:46.733 --> 00:35:48.038
00:35:48.621 --> 00:35:51.250
00:35:51.250 --> 00:35:53.094
00:35:53.094 --> 00:36:00.992
00:36:00.992 --> 00:36:03.097
00:36:04.179 --> 00:36:13.472
00:36:13.472 --> 00:36:39.974
00:36:39.974 --> 00:36:42.356
00:36:42.356 --> 00:36:51.802
00:36:53.864 --> 00:37:06.829
00:37:06.849 --> 00:37:15.996
00:37:15.996 --> 00:37:34.027
00:37:34.027 --> 00:37:36.248
00:37:36.248 --> 00:37:45.635
00:37:45.635 --> 00:38:16.525
00:38:16.525 --> 00:38:34.324
00:38:35.271 --> 00:38:54.137
00:38:54.137 --> 00:39:11.309
00:39:13.577 --> 00:39:17.126